Alternative Element Systems

[T'ani-L'ai]

I love the exploration of alternatives to the standard system of classical elements, whether they be cultural beliefs or personal beliefs.

I know most people tend to use the Greek model in their workings (Earth, Air, Fire, Water, Aether), but I know the Chinese model is popular with many, as well (Fire, Earth, Water, Metal, Wood). Personally, I'm becoming more enamored with the idea of using Chinese characters in my craft because of the potential for projecting energy into the art of producing the character, whether through ink on paper to burn with a spell, or perhaps carving it into a candle for long-term use.

I want to know what you guys think of alternative element systems and if you have your own interpretations on what elements you believe make up the Universe.

[SpiritTalker]

Both the Greek and the Chinese systems are something I can relate to in a way, particularly the Chinese cycle of each element sustaining the next. That is something I've felt that Pythagoras missed in the Greek system unless you think in terms of each of the five elements as part of the whole. but that gives me a headache after about three seconds.

Can't say I ever thought of making up my own system, but if I do I know it would include chocolate.

There also ought to be something for spin, motion...the universe doesn't just sit like lumps of matter; it moves. I think that the force of motion is as much a created substance as any of the familiar elements.

[T'ani-L'ai]

Kinetic Energy! I think that's a brilliant idea. I wonder if there are any who weave properties of mathematics and physics into their own craft in such a way?

Yeah, chocolate and coffee should totally be elements. They do sustain life for many!

[Lord_of_Nightmares]

I think Sailor Moon proved both systems can work in harmony, they have more in common with each other than they look like on the surface.

[SpiritTalker]

I also think there is a lot of appeal in reassigning the elemental associations with directions to fit your location. If you live near a body of water and it is on the north of your position, put Water in the North, instead of Earth, etc. Keep good notes so you don't forget what or why you changed from the standard. Same for color associations...use what has meaning in your immediate situation, if it makes more sense to you. I feel as if the directional associations have more to do with the winds of their quarter.

[CircusWitch]

I think Sailor Moon proved both systems can work in harmony, they have more in common with each other than they look like on the surface.

Would you mind elaborating? I've not seen much sailor moon (though I enjoyed what I have seen, even if it was just the dubbed one as a teenager) so I didn't know they fitted into either system (mercury as ice/mist, mars as fire, Jupiter as electricity and Venus as light I think?). Apologies if this is a sidetrack, I'm just curious.

[Shireside]

Haha, love it when topics crop back up like this...I was just contemplating elements earlier today. The elements I include are Fire, Air, Earth, Water, Metal, and Electricity. I don't include wood for the same reason I wouldn't include flesh as an element as the body of an organic life.

[Corbin]

I think it doesn't matter as long as the system you use (as in do the mental groundwork for) provides a "whole" microcosm; a working model of the universe which you can visualise. Working models are simplifications but need to "stand up". They also however need to "feel" right.

Make an echo the sound can hear.

[Doktor Avalanche]

Druidry(Revivalist) speaks of only three elements: The Sea/Waters(Gwyar), the Earth(Calas) and the Sky(Nwyfre).
All existence is made up of a combination of these substances and make up the whole(Manred) of the universe.

[Lord_of_Nightmares]

I think Sailor Moon proved both systems can work in harmony, they have more in common with each other than they look like on the surface.

Would you mind elaborating? I've not seen much sailor moon (though I enjoyed what I have seen, even if it was just the dubbed one as a teenager) so I didn't know they fitted into either system (mercury as ice/mist, mars as fire, Jupiter as electricity and Venus as light I think?). Apologies if this is a sidetrack, I'm just curious.

It's more complicated than this link. But this is some of the basics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical ... ailor_Moon

[barker]

The fifth element can be hope, spirit (aether as you said), and FEAR (metal as you said)... To actualise talent.

[barker]

There also ought to be something for spin, motion...the universe doesn't just sit like lumps of matter; it moves. I think that the force of motion is as much a created substance as any of the familiar elements.

e = f, g = mc^2... I breathe this way!

[HopefulChild]

I'm still working to refine my Earth, Air, Water, Electricity/Electron, model. Fire is too broad. The Electron though, is perfectly specific and relates more to life than fire in my humble opinion. I guess you could even describe it as Solid, Gas, Liquid, Electron, more than the colloquial names.

[Shekinah]

Why not "Quantum Field" as that is the space/time fabric from which everything is materialized, even gravity (Higgs)? Most likely even Spirit is a function of the Quantum Field. Personally it's all irrelevant and should be left as has been for thousands of years of Pagan practice.

[barker]

Why not "Quantum Field" as that is the space/time fabric from which everything is materialized, even gravity (Higgs)? Most likely even Spirit is a function of the Quantum Field. Personally it's all irrelevant and should be left as has been for thousands of years of Pagan practice.

Inner: Spirit is center, soul is limits, self is life.
Outer: Heart is forward/back, mind is up/down, body is left/right (on, off).

Apparently one is trying to choose Love somewhere in all of that.